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CountGirl
Top Member
USA
823 Posts |
 Posted - 04/16/2005 : 12:25:33 AM
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Short version: On a bus, when doing your pre-trip, are you required to check that ALL emergency exits, doors, windows, and roof hatches, are easy to open and in working order? Is there any special rules for a rear engine - a.k.a. can you SKIP the rear EMERGENCY exit WINDOW on the back?
**START LONG VERSION**
We loaded lots of vault poles, javelins etc [huge rigid plastic carriers - stuff for track] onto a 2001 Thomas HDX. It was a feat, because normally we use an FE and load them through the back door and onto the aisle - it was "Bug Bus" first time to do this for us. When we attempted to remove them when we got home tonight, an athlete informed me that they had been loaded through the back window and he was going to open it. That was fine - from the position of the heavy dudes, it looked like they had been loaded from the back window and dropped to the ground. [I was not present when they were fanagled on there.] He struggled with the window, to "Pull and Push" - I didn't want him to break it, so I headed back and attempted myself. I struggled each way and could not free it, so I decided I would get the bus driver. When I arrived at the stairwell, I heard a buzzer, so I didn't go and get the driver. This buzzer belonged to the side door, and the athletes were fanagling the gear out that door at an angle - how they had put it in. So, I did my little walk-through, my little gear cleanup etc - when the driver arrived back on the bus, I asked him about the window in the back end, and asked if he could give me a lesson to open it so I would know [he knows about my little taste for bus knowledge]. I had presented it so he was "informed" of the suspected problem with the Window and then pointed it back at me as possibly not knowing how to operate it - after all, it's always possible that Count can do it wrong because she didn't know how to work it. He told me they didn't get the gear in that way, and I asked him again for a lesson. He said no to the lesson - citing the fact that he didn't know [how to operate it?] and did not know if it was supposed to be opened etc - nor, if it had to be reset/resealed after being opened.
If he is a driver, whom is supposed to check all the exits of a school bus, including the roof hatches (because we've discussed roof hatch checking on SBF), why would he not check that one during his pre-trip? I called him on it, when he told me that underlined part, and I said "I thought you were supposed to check all the emer. exits" - he told me he is only supposed to check the emergency windows (on the sides). I don't think so. My family doesn't think [he is supposed to check only side windows], either, and says he can be "terminated" for not doing a proper pre-trip. My understanding of a pretrip was you checked EVERYTHING, and if ONE didn't work, you had to down the bus for the day. Now, I really don't care about all the technicalities and stuff, but what if we had gotten in an accident [God forbid] and needed that window? Don't give me the [censored] about the fact you can always escape through another exit. You can't. Sometimes you have one chance, and only one chance, and what if that chance doesn't work? I've had questions in the past about this driver [one serious and one minor] and I'm wondering where to go now.
**END LONG VERSION**
Thank you for your input. The long version did well for me to work out my feelings - thank you - so...as of Monday/Tuesday, I will ask a driver of Bug if she has ever played with Bug's windows...hmm. Anyone care to propose how I might break this to the bus barns if the other driver of Bug Bus has played with his windows before?
Thanks,
Count |
Edited by - CountGirl on 04/16/2005 12:01:25 PM
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thomas86_a
Top Member
USA
4413 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2005 : 11:48:28 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by subsbd
Before you rat on the driver consider this.
Why were students operating the emergency exits? Did someone get permission from the driver to do so? Why were objects being loaded on the bus that would obstruct the aisle and were probably not secured? Maybe the driver is wrong but are you right?
Furthermore, I don't do my job based on student input. I'm not a student's friend, I'm their school bus driver. If a student has an issue with my abilities, then the appropriate course of action is to notify their parent or school official and let them deal with it.
Yes there are situations where an exception might be warranted. This wouldn't be one of them. You're jumping to an unwarranted conclusion that the driver doesn't know how to operate the back emergency window. Remember that when you state something as fact, you had better know it to be fact and not just your opinion. Sorry to sound harsh but I think you're going somewhere you might not want to be going.
I agree with SUBSBD, you need to be careful with what you do. And he has a valid point with the equipment that you are loading on the bus, Michigan law does not allow the aisle or exits to be blocked and my bus doesn't move if they are. It is a safety hazard and also driving a conventional it's very easy for people to see in and see that the exits/aisle are blocked. So while people and/or police may not have been able to see that in an HDX the equipment being loaded inside of that bus was not exactly legal from the sounds of it.
I'm guessing that since the equipment was unloaded he wasn't worried about it and didn't feel like giving anyone lessons on how to open it. Some window exits just have a tendancy to stick and need a little force to open them, especially one of that size. |
If you have an International, you NEED customer service. |
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CountGirl
Top Member
USA
823 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2005 : 12:01:02 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by subsbd
Before you rat on the driver consider this.
Why were students operating the emergency exits? Did someone get permission from the driver to do so? Why were objects being loaded on the bus that would obstruct the aisle and were probably not secured?
The students were operating emergency exits because that is how we get the gear in and out of the bus. The reason the objects were being loaded on the bus is because they are too large to fit in any cargo bays and they have been loaded on the bus for as long as I have been a track person, even longer. We have a common courtesy between drivers and students that we are allowed to operate the emergency doors to get gear in and out. |
Give me a yellow object. Yes. Right now. I need my yellow chocolate, for goodness sake! |
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Thomas Ford 85-16
Top Member
USA
4177 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2005 : 1:15:26 PM
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| I think she was merely wondering how pre-trips are done, and what exits are required to be opened, not asking how to properely rat out a driver. |
Mike's Bus Yard - http://buses.zwebpages.com - Since 1999
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JC Theriault
Top Member
Canada
1326 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2005 : 7:49:51 PM
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"I've had questions in the past about this driver [one serious and one minor] and I'm wondering where to go now."
Sounds like she's thinking about ratting out the driver in the above sentence. Not a good move if you want to stay on the good side of the drivers, especially if you are incorrect in your assumptions.
JC |
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coolbusdriver
Top Member
Canada
1509 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2005 : 05:10:48 AM
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quote:
We loaded lots of vault poles, javelins etc ...onto the aisle
who loaded/ unloaded the bus is not important here. My concern is that this large equipment is in the aisle of the bus clearly blocking the emergency doors. Here this would never be allowed. I think the bus company needs to look into this and the school needs to find another way to transport this equipment. I shudder when I think what could happen if this bus was involved in a rollover.
quote:
they have been loaded on the bus for as long as I have been a track person, even longer.
obviously someone was asleep at the wheel to allow this to go on for so long, this needs to stop. Good thing you brought this to someones attention countgirl. |
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Rich
Top Member
United States
5768 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2005 : 12:39:19 PM
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| Anybody who doesn't know how to open an emergency window shouldn't be driving, or riding, a "regular ed" school bus! |
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CountGirl
Top Member
USA
823 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2005 : 02:37:01 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Rich Solano
Anybody who doesn't know how to open an emergency window shouldn't be driving, or riding, a "regular ed" school bus!
Thank you Rich! Exactly as I pictured it. I brought it up with the driver - then angled it back on me so that he would not feel like I was "doing his job" etc - then, as an educational experience for me and the ability to know how to open one correctly in the future, I asked for a lesson.
And it sure seems as if, at least for the impression I got Friday night, that the driver may not be checking that window as properly as he should and I'm the one who caught him at it.
Looking back over the controversy my story caused, I appreciate the input from all angles. I would truly like to discuss with my coach, or a coach, how a safer way to transport gear would be - but my coach has a "Not my problem" instant delgation and mentality for some things. It is the common practice in our region, and in consolidated ways makes the most sense - that is why I am coming up to a roadblock as to how to change it. To have a coach transport the gear up there in a personal vehicle would involve compensation ($$) requirements for fuel/wear&tear/time etc - and out of our already zilch sports/track&field budget, that makes it an impossibility. But the sacrifice of safety is not appropiate either. As coolbusdriver pointed out, a rollover could cause HUGE problems. Some of our gear is up to 13 to 15 feet long, stored with other gear similar in huge rigid plastic containers. This makes it VERY heavy and usually takes one or two of the stronger athletes to move it. Other gearpieces are up to twelve or sixteen pounds apiece, paired with some of the similar gearpieces which makes the weight even more. [These are generally smaller and stored in the cargo bays]...I could go on and on forever, but I have a homework assignment, and school starts in five hours.
Any ideas on how to point out the flaws in gear transport would be appreciated. And if anyone has an idea that allows for safety AND consolidation, please bring it on because I will love you forever! 
Count |
Give me a yellow object. Yes. Right now. I need my yellow chocolate, for goodness sake! |
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Jim
Top Member
USA
581 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2005 : 3:15:56 PM
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CountGirl, a question........ Do you and your teammates ride on the same bus as the equipment, or do you take a "equipment only" bus? Although the aisle should be free of objects at all times, it wouldn't seem half as bad if the bus had no students on it and the bus was just being used for an equipment bus. However, even by doing this, the driver could be injured by flying debris if the bus should happen to have an accident and roll over. There would also be the possibility of the driver being "trapped" if the equipment would block the exits in the event of a crash.
I was going to suggest using a bus with underneath storage compartments, but you mentioned some of the equipment was even too large for that. Sounds like the only option is to transport the equipment by private vehicle. Are there any parents with large vehicles who would mind transporting the equipment "free of charge?" |
Jim |
Edited by - Jim on 04/18/2005 3:41:19 PM |
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CountGirl
Top Member
USA
823 Posts |
Posted - 04/18/2005 : 8:14:06 PM
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We ride on the same bus as the equipment. I've thought of angles like this before, [transporting by private vehicle etc] but really unless we send a coach up there we have no way to transport it within liability and insurance rules. [So parents are out of the question.] I am aware of a couple occasions (regionals) where a coach transported some of the gear in a personal pick-up - I don't know what the discussion was behind that concerning liabilty etc. All I know is we have transported gear by coach personal vehicles before, but only on special occasions, and to send a personal vehicle up there simply for safety reasons is "out of the question" due to "inconvience" and "insurance" reasons.
Don't ask me why.
Countgirl
P.S. We are required to compensate anything that goes on. For example a parent buys food at a discounted rate; that rate is written on the box along with an invoice given to the coach and we must pay it within X days. |
Give me a yellow object. Yes. Right now. I need my yellow chocolate, for goodness sake! |
Edited by - CountGirl on 04/18/2005 8:16:17 PM |
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Emergency Exits
