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JK
Top Member
USA
7307 Posts |
 Posted - 12/27/2004 : 09:16:37 AM
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2004 Editorial opinion@seacoastonline.com
DEC 27 2004
Portsmouth Herald
New Hampshire - School officials and parents of SAU 16 are to be commended for exploring the possibilities of installing seat belts on their school buses. Their leadership may help others understand that the time has come to make our school buses the safest they can be.
The issue has periodically arisen over the years and has returned to the spotlight following a recent bus accident in Boston that injured 15 Massachusetts students and a bus driver when their school bus collided with another on Route 93, pushing it into a passenger vehicle.
Children today are raised to treat seat belts as commonplace in transportation as the keys that start the automobile. Strides made in this area, which came through community outreach, education and legislation, are invaluable.
Putting seat belts on the buses these same children take to school is the next step - one long overdue. Regular passenger buses come with seat belts and laws require youngsters to wear seat belts. The fact our school buses are without seat belts is truly ironic.
The argument against seat belts on school buses centers around the fear children may not be able to efficiently and quickly exit the bus in the event of an accident. The National School Transportation Association opposes seat belts on school buses.
However, data gathered after several accidents seems to refute those claims. An example is a 1998 accident in which a Wisconsin bus carrying preschoolers in was hit in the side by a van. The bus rolled onto its side, and the children removed their own belts and evacuated before fire and rescue personnel arrived. None of the students sustained injuries.
Perhaps the cost to retrofit school buses is more at the heart of the resistance to put seat belts in those vehicles. It is hoped that is not the case, but proper installation of the necessary shoulder belts instead of lap belts will require significant investment.
Click Here for story
District may buckle up school buses
By Chris Bernard cbernard@seacoastonline.com
DEC 26 2004
Portsmouth Herald
EXETER SAU 16’s joint school board this past week moved toward putting seat belts in school buses, beginning an investigation into the added cost.
Once the cost is determined, the board likely will put the issue to voters in the district, which covers Brentwood, East Kingston, Exeter, Kensington, Newfields and Stratham.
The issue is being led by a group of parents, but the district is not alone. Nationwide, and in other countries, schools are facing similar debates.
More than 200 school districts nationally provide seat belts on buses. The states of New York, New Jersey, Florida, California, Minnesota and Louisiana have made it law.
In the 1970s, the National Transportation Safety Board mandated "compartmentalization," which includes closely spaced, high-backed and padded seats with bendable frames. The bench seats are designed to work much as egg cartons do, by keeping passengers in place and surrounding them with padding.
The same ruling required seat belts for school bus drivers, but found "there is insufficient data available to demonstrate whether safety belts would increase occupant protection."
For compartmentalization to work, passengers need to be facing forward and sitting properly.
Children tend to turn around and talk with seatmates and students in the seats behind them. A side effect of safety belts is that children will remain in their seats, meaning fewer distractions for drivers and increased safety for all, proponents say.
Compartmentalization protects best against head-on collisions, not side-impact collisions or roll-overs. That’s only about 40 percent of bus accidents, according to statistics.
A National Transportation Safety Board study in 1999 found "compartmentalization ... does not protect school bus passengers during lateral impacts with vehicles of large mass and in rollovers, because in such accidents, passengers do not always remain completely within the seating compartment."
Of the 43 accidents investigated by the NTSB for the study, more than a dozen were side-impact collisions or rollovers. A total of 420 unbelted children were considered in the study, and 272 suffered injuries.
Click Here for story
Click Here to find out The #1 reason some school buses are violent places |
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coolbusdriver
Top Member
Canada
1509 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2005 : 2:17:38 PM
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quote:
Regular passenger buses come with seat belts and laws require youngsters to wear seat belts.
none of these buses have seatbelts here. Is this a fairly new thing in the States?
One question not talked about here is who will be inforcing the wearing of these belts on the school bus? I have seen advertising in SBFM for school bus seat belts and they look quite complicated for the younger students. Will we also be needing monitors on each bus to make sure all belts are on right (or on at all)? There is certainly lots to work through before this can be implimented.
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72Corsair
Top Member
USA
698 Posts |
Posted - 01/10/2005 : 12:34:43 PM
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| I agree Elen. Also I am sure (knowing the kids in my district) that they will hit each other with them and abuse them in someway or another. |
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JC Theriault
Top Member
Canada
1326 Posts |
Posted - 01/10/2005 : 7:23:43 PM
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I think the writer of the original article was talking about some minibuses or passenger vans having seat belts. I'm not familiar with transit buses or motorcoaches requiring seat belts unless its specific to the jurisdiction where they operate out of. Can you imagine a city transit bus NOT allowing standees and having to wait at stops for someone to buckle/unbuckle their belts???
JC |
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FirstStudentKid
Senior Member
USA
126 Posts |
Posted - 01/11/2005 : 5:30:12 PM
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"An analysis of test data by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) has concluded that lap belts appear to have little, if any, benefit in reducing serious-to-fatal injuries in severe frontal crashes. On the contrary, lap belts could increase the incidence of serious neck injuries and possibly abdominal injury among young passengers in severe frontal crashes."
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"Lap/shoulder belts can be misused and NHTSA's testing showed that serious neck injury and perhaps abdominal injury could result when lap/shoulder belts are misused.Other considerations, such as increased capital costs, reduced seating capacities, and other unintended consequences associated with lap/shoulder belts could result in more children seeking alternative means of traveling to and from school. Given that school buses are the safest way to and from school, even the smallest reduction in the number of bus riders could result in more children being killed or injured when using alternative forms of transportation."
excerted from page 5 in a NHTSA report:
http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/departments/nrd-11/SchoolBus/SBReportFINAL.pdf
The safety value of seat belts was already discussed in another SBF thread:
http://www.schoolbusfleet.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=3706
Some debate in that thread centered on a much more promising safety implementation. The suggestion involved raising the height of the seats from 20" to 24". The advantage was that taller/older/high school students would not be thrown forward and out of the compartmentalization. Furthermore these seats would not be substantially more expensive than the current seats. Unfortunately, many drivers commented that these seats were harder to maintain and more significantly they blocked the driver's rear-view mirror.
quote:
However, data gathered after several accidents seems to refute those claims. An example is a 1998 accident in which a Wisconsin bus carrying preschoolers in was hit in the side by a van. The bus rolled onto its side, and the children removed their own belts and evacuated before fire and rescue personnel arrived. None of the students sustained injuries.
Please cite this investigation's report with a link. I'm interested if it is a credible government source such as the NHTSA or other industry organization. A small scale unprofessional investigation would not be very convincing.
Note that in some rare rollover accidents, seatbelts would have protected the occupants better. However, for the majority of accidents students would have been adequately protected without seat belts.
quote:
Perhaps the cost to retrofit school buses is more at the heart of the resistance to put seat belts in those vehicles. It is hoped that is not the case, but proper installation of the necessary shoulder belts instead of lap belts will require significant investment.
As noted in the NHTSA report, seat belts would also reduce capacity of school buses. This would force many schools to reduce the number of students given bus transportation. As a result, students would be forced to use more unsafe transportation techniques such as walking, bike riding, or driving to school. These other forms of transportation would put these students at a far greater risk than they would have riding a bus without seatbelts.
quote:
Compartmentalization protects best against head-on collisions, not side-impact collisions or roll-overs. That’s only about 40 percent of bus accidents, according to statistics.
A National Transportation Safety Board study in 1999 found "compartmentalization ... does not protect school bus passengers during lateral impacts with vehicles of large mass and in rollovers, because in such accidents, passengers do not always remain completely within the seating compartment."
Of the 43 accidents investigated by the NTSB for the study, more than a dozen were side-impact collisions or rollovers. A total of 420 unbelted children were considered in the study, and 272 suffered injuries.
Please cite these statistics. Also note that your "click here for story" leads to:
http://www.seacoastonline.com/news/12262004/news/55860.htm
which is a "404 Error - Page not found." Is this even a real article?
I've cited my source which is directly from the NHTSA official website. If you have official legitimate sources, please provide working links so that we can see them for ourselves. Thanks! |
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Cody
Top Member
United States
1630 Posts |
Posted - 01/11/2005 : 7:39:09 PM
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quote:
Please cite these statistics. Also note that your "click here for story" leads to:
http://www.seacoastonline.com/news/12262004/news/55860.htm
which is a "404 Error - Page not found." Is this even a real article?
It says on that webpage after the 404 Error that the site often 're-indexes' its stories from the year before, which this story was in 2004, so it was probably re-indexed. |
Edited by - Cody on 01/11/2005 8:19:52 PM |
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scottyd
Advanced Member
USA
491 Posts |
Posted - 01/16/2005 : 10:42:22 AM
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| Our special ed buses do have seat belts and the elementary and pre-school students are required to wear them. Also, in Virginia, the car seat (booster seat, etc.) law does not apply to school buses. |
Scott
Driving America's Future |
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mrbluebird
Advanced Member
USA
381 Posts |
Posted - 03/10/2005 : 05:37:10 AM
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i dont like seat belts on school busses except for the spiceal ed busses
beacuse they need them |
YOUR CHILDREN'S SAFETY IS OUR BUSINESS |
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R44 5308 A Train
Advanced Member
USA
247 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2005 : 05:52:53 AM
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| My district has seatbelts on all buses from 1996 or later. |
New York, New York, a wonderful town,
The Bronx is up, and the Bettery's down,
The people ride in a hole in the ground,
New York, New York, it's a wonderful town!!!!!
-From the 1949 classic movie "On The Town"
I love NYC!!!!! |
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JK
Top Member
USA
7307 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2005 : 07:05:00 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by mrbluebird
i dont like seat belts on school busses except for the spiceal ed busses beacuse they need them
There is no federal law requiring seatbelts on any school bus, except when a van or car is used as a school bus. (jk) |
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Thomas Ford 85-16
Top Member
USA
4177 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2005 : 07:09:15 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by JK
There is no federal law requiring seatbelts on any school bus, except when a van or car is used as a school bus. (jk)
I believe there is. When a school bus's GVWR is below 10,000 lbs, they need to have seat belts. With such a small bus, the bus's mass is too little to keep the kids in their seats with just compartmentalization. |
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R44 5308 A Train
Advanced Member
USA
247 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2005 : 08:52:00 AM
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| However, three states(FL, NJ, NY)require seat belts in all buses...my state is one of them. |
New York, New York, a wonderful town,
The Bronx is up, and the Bettery's down,
The people ride in a hole in the ground,
New York, New York, it's a wonderful town!!!!!
-From the 1949 classic movie "On The Town"
I love NYC!!!!! |
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JK
Top Member
USA
7307 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2005 : 6:04:32 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Thomas Ford 85-16
[quote]I believe there is. When a school bus's GVWR is below 10,000 lbs, they need to have seat belts. With such a small bus, the bus's mass is too little to keep the kids in their seats with just compartmentalization.
Thought the same thing. States can require it - the Feds do not. (jk) |
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buslady-582
Advanced Member
USA
334 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2005 : 05:11:32 AM
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Mistakenly, I did think it was federal law for head start kids to have seatbelts. Ours do and any younger children whose parents request can also use them. My bus has 4 carseats for early childhood kids under 40 lbs. and seat belts in 7 other seats, 2 per seat. I also drive special needs adults to the community service to work every day and they just sit right on top of the belts...doesn't bother them. But I do find them misadjusted, hanging down on the floor, in the aisles etc. They are a nuisance and a hazard when not in use.
Here's a thought....why don't "WE" figure out what is CAUSING the accidents and begin eliminating the reasons instead of preparing to be hit?! I can think of mant improvements in my community that would help. |
Bus Nut
see my " Buster" #582
1994 BB TC2000 http://home.new.rr.com/buslady582/mybus.JPG
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Edited by - buslady-582 on 03/13/2005 05:13:50 AM |
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ModMech
Top Member
USA
948 Posts |
Posted - 03/18/2005 : 9:03:49 PM
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Having been a driver for many years, and a mechanic on school busses for even more, I feel VERY strongly that ANYONE who thinks seat belts on a bus are a good idea, has ABSOLUTELY NO CLUE what they are talking about.
Busses are designed to do only one thing, and do it well, safely transport students. The primary concerns are the "worst case" scenarios like rollovers, submersion etc. Can you imagine what would happen to a buss load of students who are belted if a bus crashes into water? Everyone will drown becasue there is no way to release all those belts fast enough along with the panic of the crash. You only have a few seconds to save them all. This happened in Texas not all that long ago.
Bus accidents are all bad, there is no reason to make even one a worse tragedy by intorducing something like belts.
BTW, when you have an overturned bus, and 60+ students hanging upside-down at an accident site, how are you going to get them all unbuckeled safely? Many will fall on their heads since you CANNOT unbuckle a seatbelt with that much pressure on the buckle, so you will need to cut them. OUCH!
How about the out of control student that uses that metal buckle for a weapon, does that not count as a safety issue? |
If you want customer service, you NEED an International! |
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bosslady
Advanced Member
USA
336 Posts |
Posted - 03/30/2005 : 1:43:58 PM
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How about the drivers from New York, New Jersey, and Florida letting us know how having seat belts on their buses has worked out. I read an article that said they were not having all the problems they thought they would, such as students using the belts as weapons. According to the article, things have gone pretty well.
I have been in this business for 30 years and I have seen many changes over the years. I think in the long run they have been for the good of our industry. Sometimes we are afraid of the change, but it usually works out. I can remember when they started the drug testing for all drivers. Everyone was afraid to eat any poppy seed rolls or take any medication because they just knew they would get a positive test and lose their job. Of course, it didn't happen.
If the lawmakers demand seat belts on the buses, I will gladly do all I can to make it work in my district. If it saves a few lives, it's worth the hassle. The busdrivers I have had the privilege to know are resiliant enough and caring enough to make it work.
I just read an article about the school bus accident in Oklahoma. It said the 16 year old girl that was killed was pinned by the doors to the bus. It took 2 hours to cut her loose. Maybe a seat belt would have saved her life. It sounds as if she was thrown from her seat into the stair well. |
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Thomas Ford 85-16
Top Member
USA
4177 Posts |
Posted - 03/30/2005 : 2:29:01 PM
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| It seems like most of the deaths on school buses are caused by the passengers being ejected from the vehicle. Afterall, there's not much inside the bus that can go wrong and kill someone. So perhaps an issue to address would be strengthening the window mounting, so that they will not come loose and let a student out? Thomas's C2 advertising mentioned something about their windows being a bit beefier. Perhaps a solution for buses that are already in service would be to apply structural adhesive to the windows where they meet the metal. It'd make replacements much harder though... |
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TC3000
Senior Member
USA
103 Posts |
Posted - 04/14/2005 : 4:41:55 PM
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| And how about those tall seat backs? How long do you think until every school bus in America has to have at least 28 inch high seat backs? |
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Sam
Advanced Member
United States
390 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2005 : 7:56:36 PM
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| I am a driver in Florida. All our buses 2002 and newer have lap belts. All buses 1998 and newer are seatblet compatible (can have them bolted in to the frame). I like them for two reasons only. They help keep elementary children in their seats (no other age group chooses to wear them). Having seat belts on your assigned bus adds 5 paid minutes to your pre-trip time allowance. Here are a few of the reasons I dislike seatbelts on school buses. The students who move around the most (middle and high school) do not wear them. It takes more than 5 minutes a day to check every seatbelt on the bus. I do not like to untie seatbelts that have been tied together across the aisle. I dislike filling out injury forms when one kids bonks another with the metal part. What else do you want to know? :) |
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JK
Top Member
USA
7307 Posts |
Posted - 04/25/2005 : 12:22:43 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Sam
I am a driver in Florida. All our buses 2002 and newer have lap belts. All buses 1998 and newer are seatblet compatible (can have them bolted in to the frame). I like them for two reasons only. They help keep elementary children in their seats (no other age group chooses to wear them). Having seat belts on your assigned bus adds 5 paid minutes to your pre-trip time allowance. Here are a few of the reasons I dislike seatbelts on school buses. The students who move around the most (middle and high school) do not wear them. It takes more than 5 minutes a day to check every seatbelt on the bus. I do not like to untie seatbelts that have been tied together across the aisle. I dislike filling out injury forms when one kids bonks another with the metal part. What else do you want to know? :)
Well said. Why do you let the kids move around? Much easier to keep track of who did what when seating at least two to a seat and requiring they remain in that seat for the trip unless the driver moves them. Since I depart kids at their school, by walking the aisle and releasing seat-by-seat, there is no damage or littering on my bus. Voluntary use does not work very well and seems to escalate damage to the safety devices when the driver doesn't walk the aisle and release seat-by-seat. I personally would not want seat restraints on my bus without also requiring their use. Waste of resources. (jk)
Quit Pie
FREE School Bus Safety Ads
Free to use at websites, in newsletters, memos, the local press, letters to parents and more. Note that the photos area is under revision - The school bus safety ads area is now available. This is a very popular Website. If you can't get in bookmark the page and try again later.
There is no school bus driver shortage!
Properly train, effective support and pay that retains. |
Edited by - JK on 04/25/2005 09:00:29 AM |
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Sam
Advanced Member
United States
390 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2005 : 4:22:46 PM
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| I make sure they know they are endangering themselves by not remaining seated. Every day I tell them, over and over, like a broken record. Anyway...the main reason I replied to this question is the one reason I forgot to write. Lap belts do very little to prevent injury in a school bus crash. All the studies I have read reveal that the compartmentalization factor far outweighs the lap restraint factor. ie: when sitting in a seat properly, on impact, the entire body is thrown forward into the seatback. The force is absorbed by the entire body. When restrained by a lap belt, the upper torso is thrown forward, with the head/neck hitting the seatback in front of them. OK, a bus is NOT a car. If you want to restrain the students on the bus, a 3-point restraint is necessary to keep them safer in the event of a crash. And that, my friends, is the main reason I do not believe in seatbelts on a bus. :) |
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thomasrider
Senior Member
53 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2005 : 6:09:49 PM
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Are side-curtain airbags next after 3-point belts?  |
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Cody
Top Member
United States
1630 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2005 : 6:19:18 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by thomasrider
Are side-curtain airbags next after 3-point belts?
LOL, probably!!! I don't think I'd like that idea though. |
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Sam
Advanced Member
United States
390 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2005 : 6:35:01 PM
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| ok.....I can see deadlining every bus that has a rear-ending so the garage can replace the airbags....and yet, it's a very clear vision... arg |
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JK
Top Member
USA
7307 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2005 : 11:23:10 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Sam
I make sure they know they are endangering themselves by not remaining seated. Every day I tell them, over and over, like a broken record. ...
Your post confuses me somewhat. It sounds like you're saying the kids often defeat compartmentalization, which would support that they are not safe in the event of a crash. NHTSA has made it as clear as bureaucrats can that compartmentalization ONLY WORKS when students are sitting properly. And does not work for children under fifty pounds, which is one reason restraints were recommended by the engineers coming up with the compartmentalization concept in the Seventies. Then it seems you are stating a 3-point restraint is necessary to keep them safer in the event of a crash, because when "restrained by a lap belt, the upper torso is thrown forward, with the head/neck hitting the seatback in front of them" - which by the way there exists no documentation of such an event resulting in devastating injuries on the thousands of buses using lap belts in the U.S. and Canada. The least injured child in the Tennessee-Georgia train/bus crash was wearing a lap-belt, thrown violently to and fro and still sustained the least injuries, is one of many so-called rare examples. And finally, that the restraints are voluntary, which in turn defeats that safety feature. Your descriptions represent an excellent example of our bureaucracy at work confusing the issue to the point their credibility is in question. Myself, seat-belts or no seat-belts, any child refusing to sit within school policy has a right not to ride the bus, but instead to be escorted to the school office to discuss whatever the child's issue is that day while the rest of us continue the route on schedule. My bus does not leave the school until all is in good order and is expected to remain that way throughout the route. As far as seat restraints, I can find no problem with these devices or the kids what-so-ever. The problem is with the adults involved wasting resources and setting up situations that promote unsafe practices rather than effectively supporting their bus drivers efforts. Required installation, then voluptuary use? What rubbish is that? I would not want restraints on my school bus under those confusing expectations. There, and there only can I find agreement with no seat-belts on the buses. However, with effective bus driver support, bring em' on. I'm ready and so are my kids. (jk)
Quit Pie
FREE School Bus Safety Ads
Free to use at websites, in newsletters, memos, the local press, letters to parents and more. Note that the photos area is under revision - The school bus safety ads area is now available. This is a very popular Website. If you can't get in bookmark the page and try again later.
There is no school bus driver shortage!
Properly train, effective support and pay that retains. |
Edited by - JK on 04/26/2005 11:28:09 PM |
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JK
Top Member
USA
7307 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 09:01:20 AM
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Educators face bus belt debate
By JERRY MANTER, Staff writer
Opinions vary as to whether devices are really necessary
May 08 2005
The Coeur d'Alene Press
COEUR d'ALENE, IDAHO -- It's always been an important rule for Lisa Mason and her three children.
Get in the car, buckle your seat belt.
"It's just a rule of mine," said Mason, who has twin boys in the second grade and a daughter in fifth grade at Spirit Lake Elementary. "When they ride their bikes, they always wear a helmet."
It just seems natural and the right thing to do, Mason says, for her children to be in seat belts while they're transported to and from school. But her children's Spirit Lake bus, just like a majority of the 2,700 buses throughout the state, are not equipped with seat belts.
And that worries her.
"I can see kids standing up on the buses," she said. "I just think it would be really good for safety."
Lisa's son, Greg, said he'd feel more safe if seat belts were installed on buses.
"I think we'd be safer if we got in a crash," the second-grader said.
•••
So what is the safest thing for Idaho's children?
"I strongly feel that lap belts are not the way to go," said Carol Brown, Coeur d'Alene School District's transportation supervisor. "All of the testing that has been done points to lap belts being more unsafe."
Since the 1970s, federal officials implemented major safety improvements for the famous yellow buses, including raising the height of the back seat and providing a compartmentalization effect for passengers inside. Compartmentalization involves placing a high padded barrier in front of each student. This is coupled with an elevated ride height, which removes the occupants from the impact zone of most vehicles on the road.
"It makes it very safe for transportation," Brown said. "The bus structure is made stronger than a car."
The National Association of State Directors of Pupil Transportation Services reports that there are fewer than 10 school bus passenger fatalities each year out of about 10 billion student trips. It's also stated that more than 800 school-aged children are killed each year in passenger cars or other private vehicles during normal school hours.
Click Here for story
Bus Violence Pie | Quit Pie
FREE School Bus Safety Ads
Free to use at websites, in newsletters, memos, the local press, letters to parents and more. Note that the photos area is under revision - The school bus safety ads area is now available. This is a very popular Website. If you can't get in bookmark the page and try again later.
There is no school bus driver shortage!
Properly train, effective support and pay that retains. |
Edited by - JK on 05/10/2005 11:39:48 PM |
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1042
Senior Member
USA
156 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 6:51:34 PM
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It's obvious (and understandable) this idea has been floating in the industry for quite a while. We can see this particular comment thread has been active for some time too.
I thought I had "weighed in" on this a few times before in our forum but I don't know when or exactly where.
I noticed a question/comment on the subject has again surfaced in a news story printed today on one of today's bus accidents - the one in Mass., I think. The lady (whom I believe just happened to be a bystander and helper at the accident scene) is quoted as questioning why school buses don't have seat belts, and offers her opinion that she thought there were a lot of student injuries caused by passengers banging into the seatbacks presumably. . .
Modmech made a comment on this thread back in March that I agree with wholeheartedly. I'm going to echo his input with a little less tact than he used.
I've been a cop in metro Atlanta for over 25 years and now in retirement have been driving a big yellow limo and enjoying it too, for 5 years. I know about wrecks. I know about deaths. I have seen 'em, worked 'em, handled 'em, smelled 'em, and gotten them all over me many, many times. There are many reasons why seatbelts don't belong on any full sized school bus. There are a few emotional aspects of serious traffic accidents that make it easy to say school buses ought to have seat belts on them. Recently there seems to be a few politicians and even a couple of "expert" types trying to justify endorsing school bus seatbelt installation - or rather legistlation that would require them be installed.
Regular school buses are constructed and used in a manner that seat belts should not be on them. Period. People who think they should be on regular buses haven't fully explored the issue, they are ill-informed. Either that or they are idiots.
I hope anyone reading this will pardon my bluntness. This issue isn't one which has any gray area in my estimation. |
1042 |
Edited by - 1042 on 05/09/2005 6:55:10 PM |
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Kittybus
Active Member
40 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2005 : 07:47:12 AM
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Seat Belts on School buses would not be safer. There would be injuries from kids hitting each other with them. YOunger students would not be able to buckle them or unbuckle them, which would mean the driver would have to do this. Some kids would just not wear them, period. IT would just be one more headache for the driver.
School BUses are very safe. If we as parents and teachers taught our kids to sit and remain seated on the bus facing forward, feet under the seat, with back packs on their lap, then maybe more children would adhere to this rule. For some reason, children think it is okay to get out of your seat for a minute or to seat sideways. Then after you spek to them a dozen times, you write them up, then you are a "*****" becaues they were not misbehaving. The teachers laugh, when they read a bus slip that states the child was out of their seat. People just do no think it is a big deal. They do not realize how dangerous this can be. Seat Belts are not the answer. |
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the_bus_drivn_man
Active Member
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2005 : 11:46:23 AM
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| i don't think that seat belts on buses would not be the smarest thing to do. kids would use then as weapons and there is not way for the driver to inforce them. also if there was a reck it could be harder for the children to get out. |
Matt |
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JK
Top Member
USA
7307 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 09:22:02 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by the_bus_drivn_man
i don't think that seat belts on buses would be the smartest thing to do. kids would use then as weapons and there is not way for the driver to enforce them. also if there was a wreck it could be harder for the children to get out.
Yes, very true. But what you say is only true were driver activities and school staff support are grossly lacking.
Drivers that sit in their seats, doing nothing to govern activities while students are departing at school create all sorts of unwanted anomalies. Understand the pack mentality of children, their experimental, structural and survival instincts at the most basic levels, then do what puts you in charge of the pack. I've said before: To establish territory the bus driver must walk the bus and spray (pee - figurative) in every corner of the school bus. Get out of the seat and depart students seat by seat. Walk among the kids while they are boarding at school, separating any that appear to be a bad mix for the ride home. Seat undercapacity runs at least two per seat from the front, leaving the back clear of k-8 students when possible. FOR YEARS transporting k-12 there has seldom been any damage to the bus - FOR YEARS! What little damage has happened (including littering) is caught in the moment. Sleeping kids and stuff about to be left behind is also noticed in the moment. A calm safe bus includes an active, involved and aware bus driver making his or her presence felt within every inch of the bus. Drivers that sit dead-like behind the wheel at schools are perceived by the kids as weak, fearful or indifferent. Indifference is the worst, the sort of attitude that sends kids in to escalations that otherwise would very rarely happen on a bus where the bus driver is actively dominating the bus environment. The kids must survive until the adults involved get their act together helping keep the bus a calm, safe place for kids and the bus driver. Survival can include violence. The quickest and most effective way to keep a bus calm and safe, seat belts or no seat belts, is for the bus driver to be the one in charge, backed by effective school staff support that works. The remainder, the kids and bus drivers left to survive under school staff indifference, are to be pitied and prayed for - about all the rest of us can do in the hope no child dies because of prevailing adult attitudes neglecting children and their school bus drivers. (jk)
Safe Practices Save Lives!
Do your school buses include:
* The bus driver trained in violence prevention strategies?
* A working video camera on every school bus?
* Children trained daily in safe practices and informed school staff and parents ready to help keep kids safe?
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Properly train, effective support and pay that retains.
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Edited by - JK on 05/14/2005 09:26:38 AM |
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Time has come to add seat belts to school buses?
